Twelve Questions I Still Have About the Kindred Saga

It’s been several months now since the conclusion of Nick Spencer’s run on Amazing Spider-Man and the end of the Kindred Saga, as it’s called now. Am I still salty? Oh god I’m still salty. Here’s 12 questions I still have about the whole sorry show. Perhaps some of them will be answered one day?

Why is Harry suddenly aware that Peter is Spider-Man?

It’s been the case ever since Brand New Day (over a decade ago!) that Harry doesn’t know Peter and Spider-Man are one and the same. But here Harry just… knows?

Granted, this one is fairly easy to handwave, perhaps Kindred told him while he was imprisoned or perhaps he just remembered it the same way he remembers he’s been dead before. Just like… one line of dialogue could’ve confirmed that though, especially since Harry not knowing was a big deal once upon a time.

Why did Mephisto want Harry’s soul in the first place?

Course, Mephisto is a giant asshole so his actions don’t always need an explanation, but it’s interesting he specifically asks Norman for Harry’s soul, especially since Harry is a child at that point. Since Mephisto knows what will happen in the future with Peter, did he also know that Harry would be a part of Peter’s life? Did he want Harry as another pawn in his game? I mean I’m GUESSING yes, but obviously there’s a bigger story there that we never got.

Why are there more clones of the twins?

At the beginning of ASM #73, Harry re-introduces Norman to “Gabriel and Sarah” or the fetuses that are supposed to grow into new versions of them. But then we don’t see the test tube babies again or get any explanation for them! Why are they there if Gabriel and Sarah are already running around as Kindred?

Who’s this guy digging graves for the clones?

Original Harry would have been dead at this point, I’m sure, so who is he? (Or could be a she, I suppose.)

What possible reason could Harry have to think Norman might come back from the dead?

COME ON!

Does the clone Harry have the original’s soul?

So, clones in the Marvel world are… Inconsistent. Some of them are basically the original soul walking around in a new body and some are abominations against nature, all depends on the writer I guess. Hey, Black Widow’s a clone now too! But she got to keep her pre-death memories due to oh god I think it was a talking bear or something, so she’s still considered “the real” Black Widow. And bearing in mind Clone Harry clearly has memories of his own death and original life too, I see no reason why he can’t be considered the “real” Harry, y’know? (There will one day be a much bigger post about this, pondering life and memory and the exact nature of a soul, that kind of thing is my jam, I’m so sorry.)

Also, he doesn’t disintegrate when he dies, which sort of implies he’s not a regular clone?

And who cloned him?

It wasn’t Norman. I’m guessing it was the AI Harry, controlled by Mephisto? But it’s never said!

The AI Harry was established before Harry’s death, so why does AI Harry in Kindred’s body remember its death?

Uh… Mephisto did it? I got nothing.

Are the twins just puppets, or do they have thoughts and emotions of their own?

Post-BND Harry says “they’re just puppets” made to host the AI Harry, but are they? They don’t seem to be “puppets” at all in the final fight, and they show concern for each other which indicates they’re autonomous beings.

I felt kind of bad for them when they died, whatever they were.

Where the hell is Stanley?

Not content with whitewashing him, the writers seem to have erased Harry’s second son altogether. He’s nowhere to be seen when Harry goes back to check on his family.

Why did Mephisto influence Harry to do something so damn convoluted?

So I’m trying to work this all out. Mephisto buys Harry’s soul from Norman, Norman uses his newfound power to become the Goblin, he dies, Harry decides to devise a plan to torture him just in case he comes back (as well as Peter), so Mephisto has him create the twins that are supposed to eventually kill Peter in order to prevent him (Mephisto) from being defeated in the future…but also pretend these demonic assassin twins are the children of Gwen and Norman? Was all of Sins Past actually the work of the devil? Heh, many people thought that anyway I guess.

What does Peter think about all this?!

“You don’t know the half of it,” Harry tells Peter, but Peter still might not know the half of it. We can assume he heard both Harry being called “clone” by the Kindreds and Harry being informed by Norman that his soul was sold to the devil, but we never actually see him process this information. Perhaps next time Peter and Norman meet Peter will finally delve into all this, before giving Norman the righteous ass-kicking he so richly deserves?

We’ll see.

7 thoughts on “Twelve Questions I Still Have About the Kindred Saga

  1. Oh my aching noggin.

    Spencer clearing out and rushing all his plotlines left such an acquired taste, I don’t blame Marvel scurrying away from it.

    Hopefully it doesn’t take 17 more years to sort this thing out

    And Stanley? I think he’s filed away these days in the same cabinet as Jill Stacy, Gayle Watson and her boys, cousin Kirsty etc. Maybe Queen Cat came back for him and hid him away in Europe? Maybe Harry gave him back to her before he tied up his affairs?

    Liked by 1 person

  2. Yeah, I am wondering about those questions too. Gabriel and Sarah obviously had their own emotions. Than what kindred said, like: ‘I love you both so much, why you do that to me.” and so on were the real thoughts of AI Harry (which was influenced by Mephisto) or the acting of Gabriel (which may also be influenced by Mephisto) just to make Peter feel bad? I think Harry is a unique character in Marvel Comics. But regrettably, it seems that most writers can’t see his charm and have little respect to him.

    Like

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